Author: Sally Perry
Ventnor Planning Meeting Tonight: Turbines and Seafront Developments
Monday, 14th December, 2009 at 5:35 pm, Isle of Wight
The Ventnor Town Council will be meeting tonight to consider several local planning applications.
Included in the list is one from the Ventnor Golf Club for three wind turbines, as well as two re-applications for the development of Beachlands and Cedar Lodge , both of which are on Ventnor seafront.
The meeting starts at 7pm and will be held in the main hall. Members of the public are allowed 15 minutes to make statements at the beginning of the meeting.
We hope to attend, so if you can’t, we’ll report back on VB later.
Image: respres under CC BY-SA 2.0
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Turbines at the Ventnor Golf Club were approved by the VTC – more details to come tomorrow.
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The Town Council recommended this application with the request that statements in the Environmental Impact Survey concerning “predicted noise levels” should be quantified.
Cllrs. George, Lucas,Garlick, Welsford, Mew and Bartlett voted in favour.
Robinson and Perks abstained. I couldn’t see what Scottia did, sorry. There were no votes against as far as I could see.
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Sorry again, that should have been Scoccia, pronounced Scottia.
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Sal, your statement that “Members of the public are allowed 15 minutes to make statements at the beginning of the meeting” is, sadly, not what the Town Council appears to believe.
Those of us who were prepared for a reasoned debate, and a chance to make a short statement, on the Golf Club wind turbine proposals, were shocked when the Chairperson announced that this was a Question Period, not an opportunity to make statements.
She spent the short time allocated arguing with members of the public as to whether they were asking a question or not. Those of us who then adopted the technique of Prime Minister’s Questions: “Is the Council aware … ?” were ruled out of order, and the whole thing descended into farce – certainly there was little chance of any councillor taking on board anything said by the public, and although these were supposed to be “questions”, there were no “answers” to anything forthcoming.
When I have had a chance to recover from this shambolic travesty of democracy in action, I hope to share some of the details. The meeting disposed of one of the most important planning applications of recent times in 5 minutes flat, with half the councillors ruling themselves out (abstaining or absenting themselves) for one reason or another, and no attempt at any reasoned debate or rationale addressed to the substance of the application.
Of the only two councillors who spoke, one was inaudible except to the front row, and the other used the deficient microphone which produced booming harmonics and was therefore also unintelligible. But the tenor of these two remarks appeared to assume that a general support for “wind energy” automatically implied support for turbines anywhere. Buster Bartlett seemed to think that turbines on Rew Down (fed into the Grid) would stop any electricity blackouts in St Lawrence. It was rather like being in support of “Motherhood” and using this to imply that it was perfectly fine for 13-year-old schoolgirls to become pregnant.
As an intellectual exercise, the proceedings of the Town Council Plans Committee doesn’t even make it to Key Stage 1.
– Dennis.
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You’re right Denis, the normal protocol is for questions being asked before the TC meeting and statements to be made before the plans meeting.
I did question this change of protocol at the end with chair of the plans committee, Joan Garlick, who informed me that the change was made exclusively for that meeting and normal service would resume as of the next plans meeting.
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Does that mean that Joan Garlick changed the rules unilaterally just to shut out any public input on the wind turbines ?
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Did Councillor scoccia object to this change?
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Scoccia
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It wasn’t clear whether the change in protocol had been agreed unilaterally or by the council as a group.
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Dennis The vote did not go your way then?
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Well Done VTC…a message has been sent to the IOW COncil (do Nothings)…we will at last see progress ( and turbines) on the Island.
I might just join the golf club and recommend all my friends and associates to do likewise
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You should do No 5 – my husband is a member and Ventnor Golf club is a lovely ‘artisan’ club (true to it’s roots).
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They could well afford to reduce their membership fees now. Not just a round, but a round, a round, a round the turbines turn.
They will have a great cooling effect in summer:-)
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Good offer on at the moment No 5 – £150 Full Membership for a year!
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Thankfully ALL town councils are pointless and toothless. The real planning committee usually ignores their ‘advice.’
As for question time, why would (even) town councillors waste their precious time listening to hysterical beardie ecomentalists lecturing them on ‘man made climate change?’ The arguments are well rehearsed and very boring.
As for Copenhagen. It’s the shambles we all expected it to be. Everyone has wasted their time, except the third world countries who’ll be given billions to ‘clean up their act.’ The cash will of course be spent on limos, jets and diverted to Swiss bank accounts as usual.
Happy Christmas and all the best for 2010
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What a sad little world you live in
well Happy Christmas to you too
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Shobba, I think “man-made climate change” is too sophisticated a topic for VTC, and never came up. The people attempting to be heard were locals concerned about the impact of the turbines on their environment, the noise, traffic, runoff from all the conctrete and tarmac, and the dishonesty of the Golf Club in slipping in their Golf Village proposals in digestible planning chunks instead of coming clean about their intentions for this prominent hilltop.
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There is a very good reason why Ventnor Golf Club is only putting in an application for wind turbines at this stage and that is because they need the revenue from the turbines to proceed with any other developments.
No turbines = no revenue = no development.
They would be wasting time and money if they made any more ambitious applications at this stage.
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From what I recall, everyone who asked a question or made a statement were NIMBYS opposed to the turbines and Shobba needs to know that some of them had beards too.
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Ahem.
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Remember that when things got heated last week, it was agreed by all that personal insults lowered the quality of the discussions?
Would seem right that you should drop the use of the term “ecomentalists,” don’t you think? It’s clearly insulting.
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Go green – cut carbon – What the h*ll was Prince Charles doing there? Yet another palace PR stunt.
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In my experience, if you have something to say about any planning application then put pen to paper and write to the planning department AND to any relevant town council. If you actually live in the ward where the proposed plans are then speak to both your town and Isle of Wight councillors and have your say. Don’t just try to rely on the chance to speak at a town council meeting as it is not always possible.
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That’s right mojo. We cannot have organised, vocal groups turning up at planning meetings with the expectation that their views will win. There are proper processes for this which should be followed and respected. Even if they are not perfect, it what we’ve got.
The consultation is via the County Council Planning Department.
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With respect to last evening’s Planning Committee meeting I would like to correct, for the record, some of the ridiculous and incorrect statements that were made by those objectors who wanted to turn the meeting into a speech-making forum for their own deluded ideals.
I was sitting to the right of the committee about 10 rows away and I had no problem in hearing what was said, either with or without the ‘deficient’ microphone. Fifteen minutes is a very short time and if for example anyone present wished to rebutt any statement (and there was a lot to be rebutted from the ‘objectors’ even in the little they got away with saying), that time would soon evaporate and others would not get the chance to make their points. That is exactly the method used at the Cheverton meeting; the objectors, including ThWART, launched into a tirade which included untruths, half truths and downright innuendo which could not be rebutted in the time alloted. This is a basic flaw in the procedure and is the reason why no constructive debate can be had in planning meetings.
If planning does get consented, Denis, the the electricity produced WILL be fed into the local grid which serves Ventnor & District. Fact.
Shobba and Dennis, please be very careful when accusing Ventnor Golf Club of ‘dishonesty’ We have never been dishonest and have cooperated fully with both Town and County Councils. Unlike you (who only seems to be interested in your own opinion) we have to deal in hard facts. You deny climate change despite the evidence whilst never producing any evidence to back up you wild claims. You deal in innuendo and rumour. We do not because there is too much at stake. We employed surveyors, engineers, energy consultants, planning consultants, ecologists, archaeologosits, wildlife experts, bat experts, butterfly experts;in fact recognised professionals in evry field that may have been of concern in the preparation of our applicatio. It has taken two years of hard and dedicated work.
We copmpleted an Environmental Statement, as directed by the Government Office South East (even though it is the Council’s stated opinion that one was not needed). The ploy of some objectors seems to be: never mind that the professionals are happy that there is sufficient information upon which to make an informed decision, no matter – we’ll try to stop them by making it too expensive to carry on (Mr Nash et al).
Well none of these ploys will work. The EIA is complete. It has addressed and answered on the matters of noise, bats, birds, horses, squirrels, traffic, construction, environment and all other relevant matters. Yes it was very expensive and we would rather not have done it. But it is a comprehensive and detailed Environmental Statement compiled by recognised experts who are rightly proud of their independence and expertise.
We are happy to be judged on the merits of our case.
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Well said Mr Blackmore,mind you what ever point of view you had, last night,s meeting was horrific most of Ventnor Town Council should hang their head in shame.As for the Chairperson well word,s fail me.I support the plan,s but even I came away incandescent with anger .Help!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Do you think the Chairperson had tried to stop the meeting being hijacked?
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Spot on, Rush
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Well said Mr Blackmore -
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The ‘Ahem’ comment above was actually meant as a wry comment for you Simon.
In truth, I have given up Shobba baiting. It was a bit of fun at first to let his preconceptions define my attributes (left wing, bearded, ex-Greenham Common partner etc, not to mention my name) but I am saddened and bored with the wilful pride he takes in his small-mindedness and have decided to cease communication. The irony is that his simple intellect will consider this a victory.
I heartily recommend that the rest of you stop replying to Shobba also. Perhaps he’ll go away.
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For clarity, my “Ecomentalist” comment was directed at Shobba using it as a term of insult, not in your choice of posting name (picked as a reaction to the insults).
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None taken.
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Well said Ecomentalist. The only way to get rid of Trolls is to ignore them.
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Mr Blackmore. Perception is all. What I saw at the Cheverton meeting was the exact opposite. It was the pro lobby who shouted the loudest. It was the pro lobby who applauded each other noisily as they made daft statement after daft statement about ‘global warming’ and the destruction of the planet. No-one was persuaded. The statements were at times embarassing.
In truth I honestly felt sorry for this noisy minority. It seemed to me that the majority of committeee members were glazing over rather than being taken in by these silly arguments about saving the planet. Not their job mate! They are charged with deciding isle of wight planning applications, not saving the planet.
As many senior national political figures are saying. ‘Why do the climate change lobby become so aggressive and dismissive when any doubt is raised? If they were a little more scientific rather than hysterical they may get more people listening and making up their own minds.
Thankfully the politicians in Copenhagen look like they are being fairly sensible, not falling victim to those who insist the world will end if we don’t build more wind turbines and stop driving, flying etc etc.
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Shobba Eco-Island?
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I don’t think you’re being straight here. I don’t recall groups of people shouting loudly at the Cheverton Down meeting, it was remarkably civilised. The only loud shouting I remembered was one person who shouted out at the end – after the decision.
It appears that the behaviour of those against the wind turbines at the Ventnor TC meeting was considerably less gracious.
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Simon. Are ecomentalist’s posts to Shobba not also insulting?
‘small minded’ ‘simple’ etc
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